S3E2: How to Deal with a Narcissistic Mother

Leann Evans grew up with a narcissistic mother and didn't realize that was the problem until much later in life. She had thought her mother was just abusive. She has traveled the healing journey and now helps others to heal.

As a Life Coach, Leann gets to meet and touch the lives of people from all walks of life. This is an amazing opportunity not everyone has the pleasure of doing. Well, she is not just a life coach, She's an Empowerment Coach and doesn't just help anyone. She serves the Daughters of Narcissistic Mothers! Leann helps them empower themselves to find the joy that was lost in their childhood and release their trauma.

Social media and contact information:

www.facebook.com/donm.isurvived

www.instagram.com/donm.isurvived

Leannevanscoaching.vipmembervault.com

Email: info@leannevanscoaching.com

Podcast Transcript

[00:00:00] Damaged Parents: Welcome back to Relatively Damaged by Damaged Parents. Today, we have a fantastic guest with us. Her name is Leann Evans. She is with Leann Evans Coaching. You can find her on Facebook. The username you would look up is D O N as in Nancy, M as in Mary dot I survived. Leann. What does @DONM.Isurvived mean?

[00:00:24] Leann Evans: You're actually the first person to ask me now. So it stands for daughter of narcissistic, mother,

[00:00:30] Damaged Parents: Oh, wow. Thank you for sharing that. And I'm surprised. No one's asked yet.

[00:00:38] Leann Evans: No one's asked and I mean, some people already know my niche but no, one's quite kind of picked up what those letters stand for or us. Yeah.

[00:00:47] Damaged Parents: Yeah. So listeners, she is a daughter of a narcissistic mother. How did that show up for you in your life?

[00:00:56] Leann Evans: So mainly I don't know. I mean, it's had, a large effect, so from childhood right up to adulthood, for me personally, It meant that I was kind of kept in a bubble growing up. It stopped me from being able to make strong relationships or healthy relationships with others and also how to build boundaries and how to keep those in place. So those are things I kind of learned in my childhood. And then as an adult kind of created quite a few problems because I wasn't aware how to do those things.

[00:01:30] Damaged Parents: And is that the struggle that you're here to tell us about today? Or what's there yet? Another struggle that you wanted to share with us?

[00:01:37] Leann Evans: Well, it affected me as a parent. So I think

[00:01:41] being able to share my experiences and talking about how I was able to turn that around being a parent myself, is something that I, tend to share because it's, kind of two sides of the coin. It affected me. And then I had, children and then it also started to affect what my own parenting.

[00:02:01] Damaged Parents: Would you say you found yourself using those narcissistic behaviors as a parent yourself after you had children?

[00:02:08] Leann Evans: Yeah, I did but I wasn't. aware of what they were or where it was coming from.

[00:02:14] Damaged Parents: Okay. can you give us some examples of what those behaviors might be?

[00:02:18] Leann Evans: A lack of empathy is probably the biggest one. so that's how I didn't receive any empathy. But myself I'm quite as sensitive person. So I went the opposite way. like really deeply, like other people's problems taken on other people's issues on board, which then caused me stress.

[00:02:39] And I suppose, like depression, because I was trying to help everyone and I had a lack of energy and then with my children I then didn't have I'd say a high tolerance like for kind of childish behavior, because I was dealing with it a lot from other people. I also had to then deal with it from my mom.

[00:02:58] So when it came to parenting, I was unable to kind of deal with those sorts of it's normal childish behavior. But when you're in the situation, it can be something that can be quite triggering. So it kind of had like a knock-on effect.

[00:03:12] Damaged Parents: So like you had your children and then I'm just trying to put a picture together in my mind. And then mom was still around and you're using her behaviors while at the same time, really super sensitive to everything that's happening inside of you and maybe feeling a little torn.

[00:03:32] Leann Evans: Yeah, because you don't know how to, react. So you want to help? I can help strangers, but when it came to my own children, I didn't know that. How to put that into place because with a friend or maybe a stranger they're not connected to you. Does that make sense?

[00:03:47] Like they're not your responsibility, they're not your only responsibility. You can kind of send them away when you're finished dealing with their problem. Whereas a child is yours for life. And I wasn't shown that empathy for my mom's. I say, if I felt like. She wouldn't be loving or caring or, ask if I was okay.

[00:04:05] If anything, I would get in trouble for slowing her down if we was maybe walking somewhere. So that kind of behavior is something that came out with my children. Like if they had an accident or if they, fell over, that I'd feel really bad, but I didn't know how to, show that empathy to them. Yeah. And that was quite a big one to be fair. It's stopped me being able to bond with them in certain ways.

[00:04:26] Damaged Parents: What I'm picturing in my mind is like the child who falls, scrapes their knee, one parent, goes over there. What are you doing? Falling? Get up off your butt, come on. And let's go. And the other parent, oh, you fell, let's kiss your owie and let's move on. Giving them time to regulate again. So I think, but you're explaining this the first, as far as like what a narcissistic type parent might do.

[00:04:49] Is, kind of the get over it type of parent. And then the other one is, more the empathetic. Okay. I see you hurt yourself. I love you. Come on. We can do this.

[00:05:00] Leann Evans: Yeah, I suppose, narcissistic traits. Not everyone is a narcissist, but we all as humans have like some of the traits and can show them. But I think one of the main differences is whether it's consistent. So for me, it was consistent from my whole childhood.

[00:05:17] I don't ever remember my mom saying she loved me

[00:05:19] she wasn't very affectionate. So in terms of hugs and kisses, didn't receive that. And also I was that there's four of us, so there's two girls and two boys, but I was the only girl child for 12 years until my sister was born. So being the middle child and also being the only girl put a lot of pressure on me because I was expected to learn certain things what my mum didn't teach it. It was kind of, you're just expected to know it. So yeah, those were the kind of

[00:05:52] things issue.

[00:05:52] Damaged Parents: Kind of like, you should have been able to read her mind

[00:05:55] Leann Evans: Yeah.

[00:05:56] Damaged Parents: and then just do it. Ooh. So you found yourself as a mom though later,

[00:06:02] Leann Evans: I did. Yeah.

[00:06:03] Damaged Parents: and, then you're using those same behaviors. How did you. Figure out there was something not in alignment with who you were, I guess would be the best question.

[00:06:14] Leann Evans: The best question. I think I somehow. I always knew because I never liked seeing my mom's behavior. So I always would think that how she was behaving. Wasn't how I would treat people. So in terms of that behavior not being kind of acceptable, that's something I always knew. But what I didn't know is obviously I had my daughter quite young at 18, so I was, I'm still growing myself, still learning.

[00:06:41] I didn't know how to recognize those symptoms. So I think it was just there was a lead up to it, I suppose, with having depression. So it led to mental health issues. And it was misdiagnosed just as the baby blues. And I got told it will go. And obviously it didn't, and it just eventually got worse. So I think when that got to a point where I wanted to deal with that, and I realized I was getting more and more irritable, and it was just simple childhood behaviors that my daughter was displaying.

[00:07:11] Like she was not a particularly bad child. She's actually very well behaved. And The second child he's six they're quite well behaved children. So I think seeing that I was becoming irritable at simple things was when I knew that something had to kind of be done about it.

[00:07:29] Damaged Parents: So that's what started you on your, personal journey? I think is what I'm hearing like to healing.

[00:07:36] Leann Evans: Yes. Well, I'd say yes and no. I think in terms of my own mental health yes, but in terms of healing my mom was still in my life. So whilst. Trying to sort those issues. She was still involved. So it was not really possible to, I suppose, to begin healing.

[00:07:53] when the person's still around displaying the same behaviors.

[00:07:58] So actually the, point of actually dealing with this was probably about four years ago, 3, 3, 4 years ago, when my mum actually tried to get my children taken from me, And it's something I've spoken about quite openly on social media and within my own group. So in a safe space, but not a lot of people close to me actually, know what happened?

[00:08:20] But yeah, she tried to get them taken from me and I just thought that couldn't continue. It was so damaging that if I didn't sort my own problems out and. cut her out, then I could have lost my children and that kind of keeps the ball rolling with me wanting to like seriously, get help and start therapy and to really start digging into things.

[00:08:44] Damaged Parents: Gosh, I'm just sitting here thinking of what that would feel like to have a, parent try to take children away, not like a parent of parents. That's what I mean. Like if a parent of the parents and it being your own, mother. Whoof! Would you say that? Because she did that. It actually, in some ways, or really maybe quite forcefully put you in a position where you had to heal.

[00:09:14] Leann Evans: Yeah, I'll find it. Yeah. I've never looked at it that way, but I'd kind of. had no choice. So I've slowly been trying to get help over the years, which can be difficult finding the right therapist or finding the right service. And especially if you're not quite sure what the problem is, it's kind of hard to ask for the right help.

[00:09:33] Damaged Parents: And at that point, you had no idea mom was a narcissist and you were dealing with these types of behaviors.

[00:09:40] Leann Evans: no, I would never have used that word. Before then. I probably would have just stuck with the word abusive. And I've used that my whole life. She was physically and emotionally abusive, growing up, but I had then a lot of support around me at the time when that was going on. So I had friends and a partner at the time who was actually helping me.

[00:10:01] To deal with social services and obviously give me support through that. And that was when I came across some of the support groups for daughters of narcissistic mothers. I'd never heard that term before. And I was actually put in a direction of a lot of groups and realized that I wasn't alone and that I wasn't the only person going through it And I think that for me was just major to

[00:10:24] know that.

[00:10:24] Yeah, the other wasn't

[00:10:26] alone.

[00:10:27] Damaged Parents: It sounds like it was extremely helpful to have a label. And I'm wondering if it also at the same time, in some ways broke your heart, that this was mom, that she struggled with this mental health disorder.

[00:10:42] Leann Evans: I would say I've always held space for her. I mean, everyone has things that they go through and everyone has problems, you know, to different degrees. And I am aware of some of the things that could have possibly like triggered my mom's behavior. But I think as I've got older, I've realized that actually that wasn't my responsibility to have to hold that space for her because I'm the child and it was her job to keep me safe.

[00:11:09] But whereas it was the other way round. It was me kind of being emotionally responsible for her. So I think I've always kind of had that sensitivity towards her, I think with the social services, what it kind of showed to me that no matter what I did and no matter how much I tried.

[00:11:27] To involve her, in my life, that it wasn't going to be the relationship that I wanted. And I think having to accept that, it was probably one of the biggest things that helped me to start opening up about some of the things that I'd gone through and how it was affecting me and affecting my children.

[00:11:44] Damaged Parents: What changes have you, or did you see in the children once you started making these changes?

[00:11:50] Leann Evans: Quite a few things. think the biggest thing was communication. So we always, had a more open relationship than what I was able to have with my mom. But I think us being able to actually sit and talk without it becoming a distressing situation, like just a normal conversation, without me getting irritated or without them getting irritated.

[00:12:14] And actually my daughter being more open about how I was making her feel, which really hurt. That was tough. to I have to hear some of the negative things like the negative behaviors that I was displaying. Well, I think for us to, take that step forward, we, both needed that. so Yeah.

[00:12:30] that just seeing my daughter become a little bit more confident she's 18 now.

[00:12:34] So I think seeing her become a bit more confident. And being able to voice her opinions. My little one is not affected by that. he's very opinionated and he's very, he'll just say it how it is. So I think I learned a lot between having this again, there was 12 years, I think it was the magic number 12 years between me and my sister, and then 12 years between my two children. And I learned a lot in that space. Then healing myself. And, I'm still doing that now, but doing, the big major work, it meant that I was more open to receive that criticism and to actually do something about my behavior and to let them see that they can trust me that I actually don't want to live in a household where everyone is stressed.

[00:13:18] Shouting at each other or there's abuse or, and is not the environment I wanted for them so, we actually have a more peaceful household, so yeah.

[00:13:27] Damaged Parents: so at the beginning of that transition though, cause I'm thinking teenage years anyway, 15, right. it was three or four years ago, 14, 15, she would have been right. And I'm

[00:13:39] thinking it would be really hard as a mom to be open to that criticism. I mean, teenagers can say such hurtful things.

[00:13:52] how did you. Stay in a space where you could hear and not just react.

[00:13:58] Leann Evans: We had a mediator.

[00:13:59] Damaged Parents: with your daughter.

[00:14:02] Leann Evans: Yeah. Yeah,

[00:14:03] Damaged Parents: It's beautiful.

[00:14:04] Leann Evans: yeah. when we're alone, like we've tried to have deep conversations before and I'd get a little bit upset or a bit defensive and I'd like, I don't do that. And she's like, yes, you never listened to me. And you know, I feel like I'm doing my best or, we get defensive and then we'd just end up actually not talking about what really needed to be spoken about. So I think having someone else who's not involved, not a family member, he can just kind of guide us by and be like, okay. How did that make you feel? Or Now that you've heard that, do you have a response or what would you like to say to that? I think it kind of helped stop that friction. I mean, it was still very hurtful.

[00:14:43] Damaged Parents: yeah. Now at the same time, where you in your own therapy?

[00:14:46] Leann Evans: we both were, if I'm honest. So she had a child, counselor that was just like a short few weeks of being able to speak to someone. And then I can't remember if in that moment I was, but I'd not always searching for a therapist. So I might've been on a waiting list at the time. I think I believe. But yeah, I knew it was something that we both needed and I pushed for really hard.

[00:15:06] So she had her own space, I think, given her that, where she wasn't having to explain herself to me and to feel like she's just going to get criticized or not listened to. I think that was important for her to have that. And then when we had the sessions together, so it was her. Counselor that was in the room with us.

[00:15:25] And then we did relational therapy. So we actually did quite a lot. It's all just been really helpful and the changes that it's made, and to see her as an adult now kind of going off into the world and doing her own thing and, coming and actually talking to me about, how she feels at college, how she feels at work and asking me for advice and stuff, I think it's deepened. What was already there. Cause we already had, a bond that was different to what I had with my mom, but it's meant that we've been able to work on that. And then I've been consistently working on myself and my children can see that, my little one understands.

[00:16:02] My counseling for me, cause I do it online. Sometimes he'll come in and he'll interrupt but more obviously, as he's got older, he's just recently actually understood. He's like, oh, that's a very important, appointment that you have. I said, cause it's for mommy to go and to talk about how she's feeling and so that I'm not shouting at you or shouting at your sister.

[00:16:20] And that's my space to talk about mommy's emotion. And he's like, well, like how I go and sit down and think about my emotions. Like when he gets upset, he'll go and sit down. And I think about how he's feeling and then come back to me when he's calmed down. I'm kind of leading by example really is what I want to be doing. And I thought I was going to be a positive one than a negative example.

[00:16:41] Damaged Parents: Yeah. Yeah. It's just so hard being a mom

[00:16:46] and then to already come from such a traumatic space in. So I'm thinking mom is totally out of the picture and it has been for some time.

[00:16:56] Leann Evans: Yes,

[00:16:57] Damaged Parents: Okay. And then are you still connected with your siblings?

[00:17:02] Leann Evans: not at the moment, which is a shame. It's not how I would have liked things to go, but I think I've realized that I can only control my own reactions and my own feelings and how I deal with things. So whilst they're not quite in the space to be able to do their own healing, I've just found that it's important for me to kind of concentrate On what I'm doing. it's a lot harder to do that whilst having my mom around me and, they, at the moment they all talk to her and I don't, so I'm the only one who doesn't have a relationship with her.

[00:17:35] Damaged Parents: Hmm.

[00:17:36] I'm thinking with a narcissistic parent though. It is possible that they would have to choose like loving both is impossible in mom's mind as a narcissist, I would think. And. Perhaps they don't know any other way. And that's just me putting in my 2 cents and wondering too, like I wonder if that is how it's going down and if it's quite possible, like what you said about we can only control ourselves, and that gives your siblings the ability.

[00:18:09] It seems like to me to go out and to be themselves. As far as they know how until they find it something different. I don't know. But that sounds awful lonely. What have you done in your life to surround yourself in a way that you feel supported in addition to counseling and things like that.

[00:18:26] Leann Evans: I've just began to create, a healthy connection, a healthy network of friends? So I would say I was lonely, but I wasn't alone. So I wasn't able to open up to a lot of friends that.

[00:18:40] were around. And I remember my granddad bless him saying that these people are not friends, they're acquaintances.

[00:18:46] He used to always use the word acquaintance, and I never quite understood what it meant as a child. But as I've got older and especially with going through this experience I've Realized that actually a lot of the people in my life have just been people I know they've been around. So I was never alone.

[00:19:02] I had, I had loads of people surrounding me. I just was never able to really open up because it was such a negative experience. I didn't, I didn't really want to,

[00:19:11] Damaged Parents: That's

[00:19:11] Leann Evans: Tell people that. Tell them all the nice things about me and all the fun side of things about me, like, my music and I was studying it and singing.

[00:19:20] But I never really spoke about the important stuff. So that is something that has changed. I think I've just started to surround myself with people where their friendship and a relationship is a two-way street. So I'm happy to help people. That is just that's my nature in general. I don't like seeing people in pain.

[00:19:39] I don't like injustice and if I can help, then I will be off help. But I have found that to stop doing. To my own detriment, where I'm the one who's then left without. And I now have a lovely, most of them have actually come from online. So for my business and the work that I do, I have the community that I am a part of where we all have different jobs and we all do different things, but in terms of the mindset, And I'd want to better ourselves and self-development, and most of, most of them are parents as well.

[00:20:12] So they understand what that's like. Yeah. I, I have, a network where I know I can call people if, if I need to, to, outside of counseling, and people that go out and I do things with and travel with. So yeah. Got quite a bit. Yeah.

[00:20:27] Damaged Parents: Yeah. What was it like the first time that you really started to connect with other people and in showing them where you were struggling or asking for help that wasn't the therapist like after all of this happened?

[00:20:44] Leann Evans: No, it felt it's hard to explain, to put into words. Yeah. Just like a valise and I will be honest. it was the partner that I mentioned earlier, is also something I've spoken about, but I think he was, he didn't like, look at me surface wise. He found that he saw past the whole I'm okay.

[00:21:05] Everything's all right. I'm going to be, I'm going to be good. He was the first person to actually ask me, how are you, how are you doing?

[00:21:12] And

[00:21:13] Damaged Parents: the deeper, how are you? Not just like the, the acquaintance. Hey, how are you today?

[00:21:18] Leann Evans: yeah, so

[00:21:20] Damaged Parents: Now, did he have to press it to get it out of you? Or did you willing, like, did you tentatively walk into the, how are you, or do you see where I'm going with the question or was it like, okay, here I am.

[00:21:33] Leann Evans: It was, it caught me off guard actually like. How open I was and just how freely I told him. So he, he had just called and just asked the general question. Right. How's your day. And I was like, yeah, everything's good. Everything's fine. And then he was just like, no, like what's wrong. But he heard it.

[00:21:51] He heard it in my voice. Whereas normally I would just be left. Like, I'll say to a friend, I'm fine. And they would just be like, oh, okay. Continue to talk about whatever they've called me for. So I think having someone actually go know what is wrong. And I was like, oh, now I need to tell him what's wrong.

[00:22:08] I mean, I didn't have to, but I felt like I wanted to. And then when I told him. Like what was happening. And obviously that was the, my mom had social services involved. He, he didn't turn away and be like, oh, I don't want to be involved. He was actually like, no, like, I'll support you, but I've seen you with your kids.

[00:22:25] I see how much you love your kids and you're going to get through decks. And that for me, was just a different reaction to anything that I had. Yeah, it just, it just felt like a big release to be able to actually say to someone how I'm truly feeling and not feel like I'm being a burden to them.

[00:22:42] Damaged Parents: Almost I'm wondering how much do you think you needed that in the station of no. I see there's more

[00:22:50] to feel safe. You did.

[00:22:52] And, and so you did it. And did you feel lighter afterwards or did you like totally questioned yourself later? Like be like, oh my gosh, did I do the right thing? Like.

[00:23:01] Leann Evans: No, I didn't, I, I dunno, I felt, I felt safe to be able to, to tell him that. And I think it was just his, his reaction showed me that I didn't need to hide it. So I didn't quit. I didn't question it at all. I just told him. And then I was actually able to just be more open with him in general about what was going on, because even as a, as a parent and a single parent

[00:23:25] Like we're told all the time how strong we are, and this is it's actually something that came up recently with my cousin and quite close to my cousin.

[00:23:34] I've so like payments that people see us, like day to day kind of getting on with life and doing stuff. But no one looks like behind that.

[00:23:44] And so when I think when, when someone actually says like, yeah, on the surface, you look fine, but what's actually there. It was like, for me, that was I suppose. It was the beginning of me being able to go on and heal and to have the strength to actually put my foot down and find a counselor.

[00:24:03] And so it was kind of all intertwined, I suppose. Yeah, and I didn't, I didn't know that that was gonna happen just from having someone say you can tell me what's what's the matter. So I didn't have to hide it. I felt like whenever we could. Phone conversation. If I was having a terrible day, I could say it I'm having it help create today.

[00:24:21] Children are really winding me up and I didn't feel like I then had to hide that because I wasn't going to be judged for it.

[00:24:27] Damaged Parents: So he gave you room then to have a bad day. And even, I mean, I'm just wondering, even if you kind of snapped a little bit, if, if now he's like, oh, you're having a bad day. I see. Or something like that. I mean, like that you're able to be yourself and he's able to be himself in that means imperfection imperfect.

[00:24:46] Right.

[00:24:47] Leann Evans: Yeah, well, I've seen it quite perfectly imperfect quite a few times. Yeah. I think just having, having that space is important and it also meant that I was able to give that a little bit more to my children as well,

[00:25:03] Damaged Parents: Hmm.

[00:25:04] Leann Evans: because it wasn't just all building up and building up. I actually had somewhere where I could just kind of talk about how I was feeling or even if in the moment.

[00:25:14] I got stressed with something all upset. I could pick up the phone and speak to someone and not feel like I had to deal with it on my own. It was really important to, for me to have that button. And also for there, I suppose, the ripple effect I had on my children.

[00:25:29] Damaged Parents: Right. And it, I, I, what I recognize in what you're saying is that. It sounds like you didn't go to the children to, to talk about things that needed to be talked about with other adults, it's it, which sounds pretty fantastic because I think as single parents, sometimes we forget that that's not what our kids are there for.

[00:25:51] Leann Evans: I mean, we've had our moments, I think, especially with our older one, she understands a little bit more and we've had been an adult now. I can, I can, I can talk to her openly about certain things, but there are still, some personal things that I, I wouldn't tell her because I'm still her mum. So I think having, having that boundary, if something.

[00:26:10] I have had to learn to put into play. I don't believe my mom had that with us. Not maybe not so much with me, but I do remember her, like, should you talk to my siblings? Had an older brother about certain things that would happen, which should be an adult conversation. So I think like seeing that happening around us, Hearing things that I have no comprehension of what's actually being said to me was quite confusing as a child.

[00:26:36] And I don't really, I don't want that for.

[00:26:38] my kids. So sometimes even now I will say, Say if it's to do with her dad or say to where you have to go and speak to him about that, I can't really discuss that with you. Or, when you're older, you can ask those questions. If that's something you want to talk about. Okay. And just the effect of, I think me not having somewhere to release that. So I wouldn't necessarily put my emotions by telling them things, but I think it would be my reactions. So me getting angry or being stressed or being depressed and not being able to get. So it would affect them in that way.

[00:27:12] Damaged Parents: Okay. So then, so because you couldn't tell them and you didn't have the support over here, it came out in behaviors is what I think I'm hearing. Okay. So it sounds like now you've got this, this great relationship with a partner and it sounds like you have a better relationship with your daughter and with your son.

[00:27:33] And I'm wondering. When conflicts come up now, what happens? How, how do you guys respond?

[00:27:42] Leann Evans: Ooh. Mainly I will ask for my space. So with, with the little one he's sick, sometimes we'll meditate.

[00:27:50] Or I'll just say to him, go and go and you'd go And have a think about that behavior. Because sometimes, I can feel myself getting in, a little bit like. And then just getting tests and I can feel my body reactions.

[00:28:01] I've always had quite an awareness of how, like my depression or my anxiety makes me feel. so when I feel that comment, I would generally say to the children, can you just give me some space? I mean, it doesn't always work, but generally I will, we'll ask for space and then we'll let it cool down. And then we'll try again a bit later. Tends to try to speak to the youngest one. Like once he's called down or we've both calmed down then to discuss it. Cause I think when you forget about it and then it's like the next day or a few days late, our children have they forgotten and then

[00:28:34] Damaged Parents: sometimes, so we'd write.

[00:28:36] Leann Evans: Yeah. So yeah, I try to deal with it, as close to.

[00:28:40] The situation happened in as possible. And if not, then sometimes I will say, well, actually, maybe it's best to deal with this tomorrow,

[00:28:48] Damaged Parents: Mm.

[00:28:48] Leann Evans: but Yeah.

[00:28:49] we talk about it and we just talk about how we're feeling and it's, it's still hard. It's still something on working, and then I just asked him, what, what do you need right now? Yeah.

[00:28:58] I think while I'm still learning to navigate that myself, we're doing it together and I think nasty, important thing. Like I don't get it right all the time. And I, I still sometimes raise my voice or I'll still might snap and then I'll just be like, well, actually let's leave that now, please.

[00:29:14] Let's not talk about that right now. Yeah, well, we are learning together by, it means that I can show them that it's okay to have emotions and to have feelings, but it's not okay to then go and hurt somebody because of that or to hurt someone else's feelings and dismiss someone else because of, because of that. So

[00:29:34] Damaged Parents: Yeah.

[00:29:34] Leann Evans: yeah, definitely emotional intelligence is something.

[00:29:37] Working on together as a family.

[00:29:39] Damaged Parents: That's beautiful. Okay. So let's say we've got someone with a narcissistic parent and they're starting to see or wanting to make change. What would be the top three tools or tips that you would say, maybe try this.

[00:29:54] Leann Evans: Okay. I'd say the first one is two.

[00:29:58] Probably it would be to acknowledge so that you can't change the other person. It's something that I see a lot in the groups and in how, including myself, how daughters of narcissistic moms really just want their mom to be the parent. And we can't make. Most are incapable of showing the affection and the emotions that we're wanting from them.

[00:30:23] So I think acknowledging that we cannot, we cannot make somebody else change, and that we can only work on ourselves. Yeah. Probably, one of the first things I would say, cause then that leaves you open to be able to then, work on the other things, and to focus on yourself rather than focusing on everything that's going on around you and someone else's feelings. Setting I would say is to ask for how. So find even just one person who is someone that you trust, who you can speak to. So it doesn't always have to be a counselor or a therapist. But I think just having a safe space is really important. And the third one I would say is to do something for yourself.

[00:31:09] Just one thing, every. And like to build that into a habit. So it then allows you to actually do things for you and not feel guilty about it, but would be difficult at first. But I think even if it's just like one little thing that you enjoy doing and something that's just for you and not for anyone else, just one thing a day or week, as much as possible. Yeah, those are probably the top three things I'd say

[00:31:35] Damaged Parents: Awesome.

[00:31:35] Leann Evans: work is laid off. Yeah, I think I would, I wouldn't have been able to get into the deep work if I didn't have one person who was able for me to just say we're having a terrible day today without having that space. I don't think I would have then been able to, to go to a therapist.

[00:31:54] As open as I have been to be able to make the changes that I've done.

[00:31:58] Damaged Parents: Hmm. Yeah, that's a really great thing to point out. I think that makes a lot of sense. Evans, thank you so much for coming on the show. You can finally on Evans on Facebook and Instagram. Look for the tag D as in dog, O N as in Nancy, M as in Mary dot, I survived at both places and you can also find her at Lee and Evans, coaching.com.

[00:32:24] Yeah, this has been beautiful. Thank you so much, Leanne.

[00:32:28] Leann Evans: Thanks for having me.

[00:32:29] Damaged Parents: Thank you for listening to this week's episode of relatively damaged by damaged parents. We really enjoyed talking to Leann about what it's like having a narcissistic mother. We especially liked when she spoke about her partner and how he recognized her pain and supported her in her struggle.

[00:32:47] To unite with other damaged people, connect with us on Instagram. Look for damaged parents. We'll be here next week. Still relatively damaged. See you then.