S2E33: How I recovered from Addiction
Lisa Jo Barr - I have overcome a lot----childhood violence, numerous addictions, severe mental health, have learned how to have a meaningful and satisfied life doing meaningful work. However, recovery is not linear, and things still pop up. I am the first to admit that I do not know it all. I believe we are all works in progress. I love people.
I am the founder of HELL TO HAPPINESS COACHING that guides people recovering from mental heath and addiction discover and lead value-driven lives, explore and overcome limiting thoughts on prosperity, wealth, abundance and self-worth. My columns, feature articles, poetry and OP-EDS have been published in magazines and newspapers worldwide. I have been published numerous times in CHICKEN SOUP FOR THE RECOVERING SOUL, DAILY INSPIRATIONS
I also work as an Adult Outpatient Peer Specialist at a mental health center. I have traveled and worked all over the world I am also a professional artist with mediums including watercolors, mixed media and collage art. I like in Denver, CO USA and love to swim laps in the morning.
Social media and contact information:
FB group HELL TO HAPPINESS
Podcast transcript
[00:00:00] Damaged Parents: Welcome back to the Relatively Damaged Podcast by Damaged Parents were addicted, hopeful, loving people come to learn. Maybe just, maybe we're all a little bit damaged. Someone once told me it's safe to assume 50% of the people I meet are struggling and feel wounded in some way. I would venture to say it's closer to 100%.
Every one of us has either currently struggling or has struggled with something that made us feel less than like we aren't good enough. We aren't capable. We are relatively damaged. And that's what we're here to talk about. Uh, in my ongoing investigation of the damaged self, I want to better understand how others view their own challenges.
Maybe it's not so much about the damage, maybe it's about our perception and how we deal with it. There is a deep commitment to becoming who we are meant to be. How do you do that? How do you find balance after a damaging experience? My hero is the damaged person. The one who faces seemingly insurmountable odds to come out on the other side, whole.
Those who stare directly into the face of adversity with unyielding persistence to discover their purpose. These are the people who inspire me to be more fully me. Not in spite of my trials, but because of them. Let's hear from another hero.
Today's topic includes sensitive material, which may not be appropriate for children. This podcast is provided for informational purposes only and is not intended as advice. The opinions expressed here were strictly those of the person who gave them.
Today, we're going to talk with Lisa Jo Barr. She has many roles in her life. Daughter, sister, aunt, niece, author, artists, and more. We'll talk about how addiction has shown up in many different ways in her life and how she is finding health and healing let's talk.
Welcome back to Relatively Damaged by Damaged Parents today. Do we have a treat for you? Lisa Joe Barr is back. She has experienced childhood violence, numerous addictions for your mental health. And she's really learned how to have a meaningful and satisfied life doing meaningful work. She says recovery is not linear and things still pop up.
She's the first to admit that she does not know it all well, I thought I did. Darn it, I could be in trouble. I believe we're all a work in progress is what she says. And she really loves people. She's also the founder of Hell to Happiness Coaching, where she guides people recovering from mental health and addiction and help them discover and lead value-driven lives.
Explore and overcome limiting thoughts on prosperity wealth, abundance self-worth. She writes and she's been featured in articles, poetry op-eds and she's been published in magazines and newspapers worldwide. She's also been published numerous times in Chicken Soup for the Recovering Soul Daily Inspirations.
Wow. There's even more, but Lisa, welcome to the show.
[00:03:11] Lisa Jo Barr: I've been busy.
[00:03:12] Damaged Parents: Yeah. It's like you've taken every potential downfall. You've gotten to experience so much in this life and figuring out how to shift it.
[00:03:23] Lisa Jo Barr: Yeah.
[00:03:23] Damaged Parents: That has got to be challenging it's probably I'm wondering like one challenge after another, is it like, oh my gosh, I've got another challenge I've got to deal with.
Do you get like frustrated sometimes?
[00:03:37] Lisa Jo Barr: I do get frustrated sometimes. The magic of working your ass off on yourself as it's cumulative. So I've got a lot of tools in my tool box that I can implement. If I remember there are times where I draw a blank, but um, to help navigate through life, the ups and downs and all arounds.
[00:04:00] Damaged Parents: When you say, draw a blank, is that like when you're in the middle of something happening and it's just reaction sets in and instead of using the tools,
[00:04:11] Lisa Jo Barr: they call that emotional mind where you're operating and being very reactive, as opposed to responding, and being in what they call wise mind, they call that in a therapy called DBT.
[00:04:26] Damaged Parents: Yeah. Dialectical Behavioral Therapy, I believe is what that is.
[00:04:30] Lisa Jo Barr: Yes, you got.
[00:04:32] Damaged Parents: yeah, I think there are so many great tools in that type of therapy. And I know that also there were judgements put on it that it could only be used for people struggling with certain things. But when I looked at. It's like, wow. These tools are for everyone, not just people with these.
Um, Like you said, in your bio, it says severe mental health and I think that's what they usually use DBT for, but gosh, there's amazing tools. Like just, even for anyone who doesn't suffer from that, I was kind of jealous because I didn't qualify
because I was like, man, these are good. So then I just investigated and practice stuff for myself because, I think it would be helpful if everyone had those tools.
[00:05:19] Lisa Jo Barr: Oh, yeah. The four areas that it covers. It covers just about every area that you could think of as interpersonal relations, emotional regulation, distress tolerance, and mindfulness, and using it's like going through DBT, they just bombard you with tools.
And if one or two stick hey, you're going to have a better life by utilizing those it's pretty amazing. Amazing.
[00:05:51] Damaged Parents: I love it. I love it. Well, you're here to talk about addiction and we, we heard your story from the perspective of mental health before. Can you just give the listeners a little bit of a rundown from the perspective of, the addiction and how that worked throughout your life?
[00:06:09] Lisa Jo Barr: Sure. So, I grew up in a lot of violence and emotional and physical trauma. And one of the things that I a survival skill early on was to numb out. So that I didn't have to feel the pain or the emotions of what I was going through. And it was a survival skill. it served a purpose. The older I got, however it became self destructive because I was turning to things like drugs, food, sex nicotine I had a cornucopia of addiction.
And when I was lost in addiction, that was my whole focus. I mean, you can't get much done because there's So much drama happening. I tell people I work with I also work at our mental health center as a peer specialist. And when you're living the life of an addict, fucked up shit happens.
It's bound. I mean, it's like a law of physics and people wonder, oh my God, is this bad thing happened. And That bad thing happened. And it goes with the lifestyle. It's just very chaotic. And I entered into recovery when I was 37. I was relatively, functional drunk, quote unquote. I maintained a job until everything started unraveling and it was just cumulative. It was like it progressively got worse. So I was missing work. I was depressed. I was suicidal. I was, just running around so trying to medicate my discomfort and I became intolerant of any form of uncomfortable feeling or emotion.
[00:08:00] Damaged Parents: Okay. So anything
[00:08:02] Lisa Jo Barr: it became that way.
[00:08:03] Damaged Parents: That made you feel uncomfortable? Then it was time to medicate or self-medicate. probably is a good way to put it with drugs, food, sex, whatever it was.
[00:08:14] Lisa Jo Barr: And then it also became, it was like, I would drug for whatever reason, whether I was happy, sad, overwhelmed, celebrating, relieved. It was like my response to every emotion, every single thing I would turn because the feelings felt intense to me. I have some empathic qualities about me and I feel things very strong.
But the deeper I got into the addiction last time I was of any emotion. So I just go to the numbing,
[00:08:47] Damaged Parents: Wow It didn't matter if it was a happy feeling or an unhappy feeling. It just, you needed that drug because any feeling felt weird or
[00:08:59] Lisa Jo Barr: It felt threatening.
[00:09:00] Damaged Parents: threatening. Okay. Yeah.
[00:09:02] Lisa Jo Barr: some of those feelings about life-threatening even.
[00:09:05] Damaged Parents: any of the pos- well, what we call positive, I'm going to call regulating, but in even those I mean, you said threatening, but did it seem kind of life-threatening when really great things would happen too?
[00:09:17] Lisa Jo Barr: No,
[00:09:17] Damaged Parents: okay.
[00:09:19] Lisa Jo Barr: Just a real negative stuff, because it was bringing back some of the trauma of that complex PTSD as well, which would trigger that. And then I would feel like my life was being threatened. If I felt judged or if I felt angry, even my own anger would scare me so bad where it was just automatically let's go. Let's drug this
[00:09:43] Damaged Parents: Mm,
[00:09:44] Lisa Jo Barr: self-medicating.
[00:09:45] Damaged Parents: Now did you consciously know at that time that that was what you were doing or was it on a subconscious level?
[00:09:52] Lisa Jo Barr: It was on a subconscious level. Only years later was I able actually I started this journey of figuring out who I am. And that's when I started seeing what I was doing. It became conscious.
[00:10:06] Damaged Parents: Hmm.
[00:10:07] Lisa Jo Barr: I became conscious of it.
[00:10:08] Damaged Parents: Right. So anyone in that struggle right now, for those of us around those people, they may not even be aware of what they're doing then.
[00:10:18] Lisa Jo Barr: Yeah. a big element of addiction as denial. And it's just seems to be a part of the disease of addiction is, the, disease of addiction makes you believe that you don't have a problem.
[00:10:34] Damaged Parents: Yeah.
[00:10:35] Lisa Jo Barr: So, and in order for you to get help, you have to acknowledge the hey, I've got a problem.
Otherwise there's no reason to change. That's why most people have to hit a pretty deep bottom to get out.
[00:10:49] Damaged Parents: Yeah, I mean, I have friend of mine who had a friend of theirs passed away from alcohol addiction and they were never able to process through the pain and suffering that they'd experienced, that led them to the addiction. And so how hard is that? At the beginning of the journey to get sober or deal with whatever addiction, because I mean, there's, food addiction, there's sex addiction.
There's well, I don't know there's people pleasing addictions. I think there's controlling people addictions there's, you know, like, or this idea that we can, right. All of that out there, but tell us a little bit about the beginning and how you've managed to stay in that process because I'm thinking journeying to the self is not an easy journey. Like really understanding it.
[00:11:43] Lisa Jo Barr: One of the things that I had to take the risk and let people in. I was So, isolated for so long that I thought I was the only person on earth going through what I did. I didn't know. There were other people struggling with, especially with the sex addiction I didn't know anybody who was struggling.
I didn't know. I was just often my own worlds doing this insidious, insatiable behavior that I couldn't stop. So hanging around community where, there are others who have. Gone through some of the same things. I believe that addiction is a disease of disconnection.
And so when you start connecting with others, again, you start healing because you realize you're not alone.
[00:12:36] Damaged Parents: so addiction in some ways separates you from others and then healing connects again. And was that scary when you're entering into those more intimate, emotionally intimate? I want to say relationships.
[00:12:54] Lisa Jo Barr: Yes and no, with the sex addiction that I had, I was very manipulative. I was playing games. My ego was totally inflated. I thought that I was on top of the world, pulling things over on people, using them as objects, blah, blah, blah. And when I entered recovery and started meeting other people, it wasn't scary to me.
It actually felt like a relief. However, that disease of sex addiction is intimacy disease. Because you think that you're intimate with someone, but you're not as a delusion, that's just sex. So it's kind of a dichotomy in a sense that it is scary to become vulnerable and to reveal who you are to even a friend, therapist to anyone close friends. But that's another positive risk that I decided to take. I didn't know what was going to come up out of it, but I was desperate to get, well, I was desperate for something different than what I was doing, and I knew that I had to change everything in my life.
Otherwise, I was going to get sucked back in.
[00:14:07] Damaged Parents: When you say everything, what does that mean?
[00:14:10] Lisa Jo Barr: That basically means I had to change the people I was hanging out with. I had to change the places I went, hanging out in neighborhoods where there were drug dealers and familiar tromping ground where I was doing my drugs. And, I just stopped hanging out with drug dealers and things like paraphernalia.
There was no reason to have that stuff around. I didn't need to be triggered. I didn't need to it's like people, places, things basically had to change all of it. I didn't need any residue of temptation to get sucked back into the addiction, I had to change everything.
[00:14:52] Damaged Parents: So at that point, there was just no strength to be able to say no, even though that's what you wanted.
[00:14:59] Lisa Jo Barr: Yeah.
[00:15:00] Damaged Parents: Yeah,
[00:15:01] Lisa Jo Barr: Yeah. And an early recovery you're triggered left and right. Or I was triggered, left and right. I called someone in my support group one night. It was raining really hard when I was living in Chicago. And I said, I have to use, because I feel like I am going to lose my mind. I'm crawling out of my skin.
I don't know what to do with myself. And he said, well, what's around you. I said, there's a Bed Bath and Beyond he said, go park there, go inside and look at everything. So I went into the Bed Bath and Beyond. Lots of colors, lots of items, you know? So I looked at everything and it got me out of my head, which is one thing that addiction.
Just spins you into this thinking frenzy. It's like your mind is racing and you're on a hamster wheel. And to get out of your heads, you have to stop and step off of it.
[00:15:57] Damaged Parents: Yeah, which is, which is really hard. So for you, the first step in that moment, it was going to Bed, Bath and Beyond. But as, you got through your recovery and you're working on these things, did it get easier , to reach for healthier tools, I mean, not healthier tools because I think going to the store and looking at all, that probably is a good way to interrupt that hamster wheel right? But what are some other things that you would do after that initial time to interrupt that behavior that you didn't want to have anymore?
[00:16:31] Lisa Jo Barr: Well, I started doing things that I used to love, but I had no interest in and my addiction, I forgot. It's like I lost myself. So finding myself again through my writing, through things that I once enjoyed, through taking the risk asking someone to meet me for coffee and just talking, and also listening, you know, on the receiving end of someone's story, instead of it all being, me, me, me, which was where I was at in my addictive mind, the world basically revolved around me, whether it was positive or negative the world revolved around me.
[00:17:14] Damaged Parents: So when you say that, what I'm thinking in my mind is that when you say the world revolved around me, that if someone else was going into a struggle, somehow it became about you. Or if someone else was like, you couldn't just sit there. And be with them. And then through, practicing, doing those things and probably sitting in some seriously uncomfortable feelings while sitting with other people, you were able to slowly process that, is that what you.
[00:17:42] Lisa Jo Barr: Yeah. And at first that discomfort, I just wanted to go back to the addiction . I mean, I had some serious withdrawal. I was sweating profusely, shaking even from the behavioral addictions, like getting off cocaine or alcohol from heavy use of, these drugs is behavioral addictions. Like the sex addiction, like the food addiction.
The withdrawal is for real and at first, it's gonna feel like, it's not gonna feel comfortable doing something different is not going to feel comfortable.
[00:18:17] Damaged Parents: So even I think like people pleasing or trying to control other people, also what I'm hearing you say is that even in that there is a withdraw and it is uncomfortable.
[00:18:29] Lisa Jo Barr: Yeah. So now as an addict and knowing a lot of you working with other addicts to help them to guide their Journey of figuring out what they want to bring into their life. And also my work at the mental health center, working with people in early recovery, we're all control freaks. We want to control others because we feel out of control. We want some sense. of control and the whole world revolves around us and we want to run the show.
So it's like letting go of that control is very uncomfortable, but that's where, that's where the real growth takes place is when you make the choice of getting outside your comfort zone and breathing it in or sitting with it.
[00:19:21] Damaged Parents: Yeah.
[00:19:22] Lisa Jo Barr: And a lot of mindfulness meditation has really helped me along my path also.
[00:19:27] Damaged Parents: Yeah. And I'm just thinking that, that's why it would make sense to have clear boundaries. If you've got someone in your life that's wanting to control without those boundaries, it doesn't allow for the other person to make a choice. So, I mean, this is just coming to me, but I'm thinking
was that something you experienced? Were there poor boundaries growing up? It sounded like there was like, that might be a trigger for me in the future when someone's trying to control what I'm doing that, they're probably feeling out of control.
And that would be a great time for me to make sure that I'm clear in my boundaries and that it's okay. I've got it. They don't need to worry about it, but it also might be really hard for them to shift into figuring it out for themselves, which again is not my job, but I want to give them every opportunity
[00:20:20] Lisa Jo Barr: Sure and boundaries are real tricky for us addicts because most of us, if not all of us have problems in an area, we don't have any boundaries or they're very confused. they're just not healthy. We either attached to someone and we like to blame them for our addiction, or we try and control someone or, we like to blame, and then on the receiving end of someone setting a healthy boundary, if you have none, you take offense to it.
[00:20:53] Damaged Parents: Hm.
[00:20:53] Lisa Jo Barr: You know what I'm in. Like you take it personally instead of, oh, I'm going to honor this person's boundary while if it doesn't revolve around me. And it's not something that I feel even comfortable setting for myself or even knowing what else boundary is, it can feel off putting it can it can be a reason to use just like anything else.
[00:21:15] Damaged Parents: Wow. So, and it just, even other people can, trigger, not intentionally, but
[00:21:20] Lisa Jo Barr: Sure.
[00:21:21] Damaged Parents: in that normal, day to day life, and that I don't think would be the responsibility of the person who's setting that clear boundary to be like, oh, if I set this boundary, then they're going to use and therefore it's my fault.
Well, I'm thinking that's not true.
[00:21:39] Lisa Jo Barr: I agree. Absolutely.
[00:21:41] Damaged Parents: And when, you first started experiencing people, setting boundaries for you like was it hard to not blame them and, you know, accused like it's their fault that you were using because set a boundary.
[00:21:57] Lisa Jo Barr: Well, it was more like in the sense that, or it was more like, I would feel offended if someone set a boundary with me because I just wanted to do whatever I wanted. And that's part of the dialogue of all my addictions. I want what I want when I want it. And I want it now and I want it my way, my way or the highway.
And it's very childish and the sense that. It's like throwing a little fit or a temper tantrum. Well, I want things my way, but if you set a boundary with me that's bringing in you and what you want, and I don't even wanna, honor that.
[00:22:34] Damaged Parents: So anyone with boundaries you probably would be like, Nope, see you later.
[00:22:38] Lisa Jo Barr: Yeah, pretty much. Yeah.
[00:22:41] Damaged Parents: And then you're so you're surrounded by all these other people with no boundaries. And
[00:22:46] Lisa Jo Barr: Oh, yeah, very toxic.
[00:22:48] Damaged Parents: I'm just thinking it makes sense to the addicted mind, but it doesn't make sense to, I mean, it would also still be very uncomfortable because it's so toxic, right.
[00:22:58] Lisa Jo Barr: But when you're in a toxic environment, it's familiar when an addicts. So you just keep doing the same thing over and over, again. Just surrounding yourself with toxic people, toxic substance toxic environments with toxic things and anything that looks anything like healthy. It's so unfamiliar that it feels threatening or
did for me, like I'm not given that the time of day.
And so I started until I take that risk and got involved in some support groups. I took that risk and things started changing. Not all at once. It wasn't all just all of a sudden, poof, it took work and it was back and forth. It was not linear. It had peaks and valleys, sometimes three steps forward, two steps back kind of thing. It wasn't perfect.
[00:23:54] Damaged Parents: And even as you started learning these tools and gaining, you know, the information that you gained and practicing. I'm thinking it probably also felt weird and awkward for you to set boundaries and still respecting other people's boundaries. Like it was just felt foreign in some ways. What I want to say.
[00:24:14] Lisa Jo Barr: Yeah. Because my boundaries as a child and a teenager were trampled on, I mean, I didn't have any boundaries that I could call my own really, except for when I ran away at the age of 14, that was a big boundary that I set. I need to get the flip out of here.
[00:24:32] Damaged Parents: Yeah. So you seem so much more balanced than this story. How did you get to the balance? What did you do? Was it continuing to go to the, this work groups? Was it, you said mindfulness was, was also super helpful. What steps or I guess, you know what, we'll just go to the three things and if we keep talking after that, that's fine.
But what, what are like three things that you did specifically at the beginning? That helped you make the change besides the changing people, places and things. If you don't mind.
[00:25:06] Lisa Jo Barr: I don't mind.
Let me think about that for a second here. Getting engaged in the community was really important for my recovery. I started volunteering. I started helping other people being of service was different than me, always about me, me, me, and wanting to you know to get mindfulness, meditation and prayer. My spiritual life has been a godsend, literally a godsend.
And, I'm never alone and I've worked very hard at laying down a broad foundation of mindfulness practice. And it's really easy. I can sum it up in , less than two minutes. This is a technique that was taught to me by Jon Kabat Zinn, who is like, the grandfather of mindfulness.
And it's called mindfulness meditation. And what it is is you set a timer. Well I set a timer. He doesn't say to do that, but I set a timer and then you just focus on your breath, the way it is naturally, you don't force it to just pay attention to what it is naturally. And then your mind is going to wander because that's how the human brain works.
So as soon as you catch your mind wandering. Some of the thought, instead of just focusing on observing your breath, you acknowledge what you're thinking about, and then you bring your attention back to your breath without judging it, without trying to smash it, just observing that thought and letting it breathe, giving that space and then bringing it back and.
I meditated every single day in 2017, except for I missed I think three or four days. Even five minutes, I got up to 45 minutes and that was not enough, but it doesn't matter the duration if you set your alarm for five minutes and just fall into that time and be timeless with giving yourself the space to just be, makes a tremendous difference in your life.
And for me, my experience with it is there, it made a little tiny space for me to think things through just a little bit more, instead of reacting, I started responding it's magical. It's really, really, magical.
[00:27:33] Damaged Parents: So after using mindfulness, it sounds like what happened is you started to be aware of the gap between the stimulus and the response, and we're able to shift.
[00:27:42] Lisa Jo Barr: Yeah yeah, totally. So those are two things. Establishing the basics, eating regularly, sleeping regularly, going to work. Developing some friendships going out with the people on the support group afterwards, having regular conversations, watching a show, watching some comedy writing a poem. It's like when you're in the addiction, Your vision is like a horse with blinders on. You can only see what's in front of you and what's in front of you. Is your drug of choice and you're always chasing it when you're in recovery. It's like the blinders come off and you can see around you and life becomes more vivid and enjoyable.
And not at first, you have to kind of wade through that discomfort to get to the other side. You can't numb it out. You can't avoid it. Otherwise , it's not going to be transformed. Your experience will not be transformative unless you feel it. And it sometimes sucks.
[00:28:48] Damaged Parents: I love that you say that because I think it's probably true and it's very real I mean you know, my experience of the people in my life that have gone into recovery and things like that, it is awkward and weird, and it does suck at first. And one of the things I heard is that it's hard to even allow people room to be themselves and not take it personally.
Then it can get really easy to be angry or frustrated about well, you know, but they did X, Y, Z, and really it's about deciding who they want to be in that moment and how they want to respond, so it is hard at first and probably frustrating and angry-ing
[00:29:31] Lisa Jo Barr: Yeah. Going back to the idea of being of service to other people. You see a little old lady at a corner wanting to cross the street, waiting for the light to turn, Hey, you know, walk up to her and offered to help her. If she's walking if she's, Hobbling, offer to help someone move help the people in your support group. If your support group makes coffee or tea offer to help with that. Just little, things.
[00:30:01] Damaged Parents: Start with little things, and then eventually it gets to the point where in those conversations that those people can have their emotions. I'll have to take it on it anymore, but it's a process to get there.
[00:30:14] Lisa Jo Barr: And I've gone from making coffee with my support. All the way up to, I was on a board of directors a few years ago, for three years, being of service to a nonprofit, I believe in as the secretary of the board. Addicts, I have to say are some of the most driven, strong, vivid people. I know.
That, because when we were in our addiction, we were laser focused on getting our drug of choice and people in recovery take that same concept, redirect it to what they want in life. And they work their ass off and things fall into place in a much better way. I've experienced it. It's like a miracle compared to where I was. I was lost. I was like a lost soul.
[00:31:06] Damaged Parents: Yeah.
[00:31:07] Lisa Jo Barr: And I just want your audience to know that if I could do it they can do it. It is possible. Recovery is possible for me. It's been something that I work on everyday though. Like for instance, meditation keeping a sleep schedule you know, they use all these supports that create the foundation for me to build my life on and help other people build, the life that they want.
[00:31:32] Damaged Parents: Yeah. So helping others find their dreams and their purpose, and really just being supportive now.
[00:31:39] Lisa Jo Barr: Yeah, and working on, you know, like what do you believe, what is your worldview about money, about abundance prosperity. It's usually linked to self worth. So if you can start imprinting some different messages. That are maybe outside of your box, but saying them like you believe them being an actor, like you're going to get an academy award for your performance. And I practice this with my clients and it is very powerful. I developed this four-month program with the coaching The Hell to Happiness Program, based on just taking bits and pieces of my life. And I was in an acting class several acting classes. So I took that element of practicing your lines and embodying that to affirmations, to changing your brain.
[00:32:37] Damaged Parents: The response that's beautiful. Well, everybody, that would a great ending to our show. This is Lisa Jo Barr. You can find her https://LisaJoBarr.com. Bar has two R's in it. She also has a Facebook group called Hell to Happiness and. You know, I highly recommend if you're struggling with addiction, reach out to Lisa. She's pretty amazing. So thank you so much for coming on the show. Lisa.
[00:33:04] Lisa Jo Barr: Thank you so much for having me, Angelo. I really, I really appreciate.
[00:33:08] Damaged Parents: You're welcome.
Thank you for listening to this week's episode of Relatively Damaged by Damaged Parents. We've really enjoyed talking to Lisa about how she learned to recognize addiction in her life. We especially liked when she spoke about her ability to recover. To unite with other damaged people, connect with us on YouTube. Look for damaged parents. We'll be here next week still relatively damaged see you then
