Episode 21: My Son was Murdered

Justin and Meghan Smith Brooks

Meghan Smith Brooks, author of “Unraveling Grief: A Mother’s Spiritual Journey of Healing and Discovery” talks with us about her journey to healing. She was leaving on a trip when her eldest son called her to tell her that her youngest son had passed away. She explains what that felt like, her sadness and what she did to keep moving forward.

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Podcast transcript below:

Damaged Parents: [00:00:00] Welcome to the Relatively Damaged Podcast by Damaged Parents where sad, aching, alone people come to learn maybe just, maybe we're all a little bit damaged. Someone once told me it's safe to assume 50% of the people I meet are struggling and feel wounded in some way. I would venture to say it's closer to 100%.

Every one of us is either currently struggling or has struggled with something that made us feel less than like we aren't good enough. We aren't capable. We are relatively damaged. And that's what we're here to talk about. In my ongoing investigation of the damaged self I want to better understand how others view their own challenges. Maybe it's not so much about the damage.

Maybe it's about our perception and how we deal with it. There is a deep commitment to becoming who we are meant to be. How do you do that? How do you find balance after a damaging experience? My hero is the damaged person, the one who faces seemingly insurmountable odds to come out on the other side whole. Those who stare directly into the face of adversity with unyielding persistence to discover their purpose.

These are the people who inspire me to be more fully me. Not in spite of my trials, but because of them. Let's hear from another hero.

Today's topic includes sensitive material, which may not be appropriate for children. This podcast is provided for informational purposes only, and is not intended as advice. The opinions expressed here were strictly those of the person who gave them.

Today, we're going to talk with Meghan Smith Brooks. She has many roles in her life, mother, grandmother, author of Unraveling Grief and more. How her son was murdered. The complete and utter devastation that brought upon her and how she moved forward. Let's talk.

Welcome Megan to Relatively Damaged. We're so glad to have you here today.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:02:05] Thank you. I'm delighted to be with you.

Damaged Parents: [00:02:07] Thank you. Now we are here to talk about a tough subject and a struggle that you had. So can you tell us a little bit about what happened to you?

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:02:19] Well, you know, we all experienced tragedy and trauma and pain in life. It's part of our human experience, but some things kind of hit us and smack us harder than others. And for me, it was May 30th, 2013. When my son was murdered, my son, Justin was 29 years old. Actually didn't find out until June 7th,  nearly a week later.

And I was, I'm an ordained unity minister and I was traveling that day to go cross country, to Fort Lauderdale, to arrive, to go on a cruise with my colleagues for a week long convention at sea.

Damaged Parents: [00:02:54] so on the 30th or on the seventh.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:02:56] Seventh. And I've been trying to reach my son before I left to let him know that I wouldn't be available.

And  I didn't always reach him, but usually we checked in at least once a week. And so I was a little concerned, but I left him a message and, you know, we didn't live in the same state. He was an adult, he had his own life. And when I turn on my cell phone, when I arrived at baggage claim, my older son, I have two sons.

Was calling me right away and I answered the phone and he said, mom, I've been trying to reach you. Are you sitting down? You know? And when somebody says, are you sitting down? You're kind of like, Oh, this isn't going to be good. You know? And so I'm like, what, what what's going on? He goes, mom, Justin's gone, he's gone.

And I'm like, what do you mean? He's gone, mom, he's dead. They found his body in the river. I don't even know how to describe how you feel like it's like, your heart just stops. There's this, it just like you just smashed with denial. It's like, well, I didn't hear what that he just said that can't possibly be true.

They, they must've made a mistake. You know, you go through that whole thing. And the, the people that I was with said that I suddenly went white and they knew something was wrong. And I practically fell on the floor and had to sit down. And my son said they found his body in a river and we don't know what happened. And so that was the beginning of, a long journey and the first couple of months, probably where I don't know that I was even in my body, you know, it was like going through slow motion of just watching this, this movie play out that I couldn't accept being a part of.

Damaged Parents: [00:04:28] so that out of body experience to you felt like slow motion and. Like, was it kind of like you were watching a show and the world was passing you by

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:04:40] What happens when you have extreme trauma and something that just unexpected just slams you. It's like this tsunami that just slams into you and it knocks you out of your body. So you're not really in touch with what's going on. Because it's too horrendous to accept. So it is it's like everything was slow motion.

I was engaging in what I had to do. What somebody would tell me I needed to do, but it was like I was watching it happen. I wasn't really immersed in it.

Damaged Parents: [00:05:09] So were you getting up and getting dressed for the day? Were you still functioning during that time? Or how did that, what did that look like?

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:05:16] Yeah, well, in hindsight, I look back and one of the things that I started to realize that it might seem really strange initially as, as a sense of gratitude. And one of that is that I had a spiritual foundation as a minister, I was serving a spiritual community and I, and so I was used to working with other people in trauma.

And tragedy and pain and but it's a very different thing when you are having to manage it yourself. So that was an interesting observation I had and that what are some of the go-to things that I knew were helpful that I would have offered to others? So for me, it I felt an obligation to, because my whole congregation was watching me.

How is she handling this?

Damaged Parents: [00:05:57] Oh, that must've been so hard.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:06:00] So I was this constant kind of, you know, how am I being authentic to what, what I'm experiencing and how I'm showing up, but not wanting to fall apart in front of people. But I allowed myself to have that when I was in alone. So it was being gentle with myself, noticing what I was feeling and what I needed.

And would I be courageous enough to just give myself what I needed? So. I was grateful enough that where I was living in Pasadena, California, at the time I had a swimming pool and a hot tub. So I spent a lot of time in the water, just letting the water support me, letting the tears flow realizing that when you're going through trauma, your body is using a lot of energy, so you can be depleted really easily.

So. I had already been a proponent of health and wholeness and nutrition and things. So I noticed that I needed to eat things that had, that were healthy, that had nutrition that supported me because my body was being depleted more easily. So I monitored myself that way.

Damaged Parents: [00:07:02] and that was during those two months.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:07:05] the initially, especially, and I had, friends that were willing to brought me food and I found that.

It's sometimes it's not easy to accept, help from others, but that I needed to have the willingness to, why would I do Prive them of their willingness to, you know, and they're wanting to help. They wanted to do something because they cared. So I allowed them to.

Damaged Parents: [00:07:27] Yeah. So what. Because it sounds like you have been in a giving role for so long. What was that transition? you were able to, it sounds like to kind of talk yourself into giving or receiving. How did that, how did you change that perspective to allow that? Or was it just that simple? You had to talk yourself into accepting.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:07:48] I think because I I've established this pattern of this self-awareness in life and just noticing things, I would notice if I was resistant to something and then ask myself. Am I resisting it because I'm afraid or embarrassed or would it be a benefit for me just to accept it, even though it's uncomfortable.

And so I had that advantage, there was sort of this built-in not that I always did a gracefully. But I had some friends that I could be really real about to, you know, and, and just, and one that in particular that just sort of showed up with food and she wasn't gonna take no for an answer. So I, you know, I'm just, I'm grateful because it took an energy to have to prepare something.

And I it's like, what do I need? And do I give myself permission to do that? To say no, when I didn't feel like I could really manage it. I delegated more of my, my responsibilities. I gave myself permission to take naps and and to most importantly, and this is what that I teach now most specifically, is that we need to give ourselves permission to feel.

Damaged Parents: [00:08:54] And how do you do, how did you do that?

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:08:57] Well,  I think that as human beings, we push away getting into the really raw emotions of pain. You know, in grief certainly has some really deep, raw aspects to it. And I started to notice that if I love myself to just feel as deeply as I could. And let the tears flow unrestricted. You know how we want to hold back and get the Kleenex and go, Oh no, I'll just stuff it in.

No, no, no, no, no. That's not healthy because that's energy going to have to go somewhere. It's going to have to come out somehow. And that's when we get sabotaged or blindsided or end up with a health challenge. So.

Damaged Parents: [00:09:39] like you're saying lean into those feelings, even though they're not fun.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:09:44] Oh, right. Cause no, the thing is, is that there's this full spectrum of emotion that we experience as human beings and our human mind tends to gravitate to wanting the really good stuff. The joy, the happiness, the bliss, everything's going just wonderful. And we tend to think that if it's not, we did something wrong, and that we want to avoid it.

But we're denying a part of our experience. If we deny the other end of the spectrum, it just it's like it's all part of life. So I started to notice that as I was willing to go into the pain and just sob, let it all out scream, regurgitate it seriously. It's an ugly process, really ugly. And, and maybe you don't want to do it in front of somebody, but letting myself do that.

And actually, when I was in a pool, it was really helpful because I could just let the water flow all over my face and it would wash away. And, but I started to notice that it was, there was a sense of relief and release if I, if I went as deep as I could. And so I started asking, could I go deeper? Is there more.

And as I could do that, I was able to shift to a place of beginning to just evaluate how does grief serve our life? What's what's the purpose of this because we can't, we can't avoid it right.

Damaged Parents: [00:11:02] I really liked that. Can I go deeper? Is there more because. We are so used. I think society and society as a whole is so used to pushing away. I mean, certainly that's how I grew up is to push away the pain, but it's almost like a insolvent Susan. David's a book. She talks about putting the chocolate cake in the fridge and then telling yourself you can't eat it.

It just gets, it just grows.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:11:28] And every time you open the door, you see it.

Damaged Parents: [00:11:30] Yeah. Yeah. So, so I want to go back to , those first few months, because I'm thinking your older son called said  they found , your younger son. They didn't have a lot of information. I'm thinking periodically you're getting calls and being notified of things.

And was it, did it re trigger? What happened?  what was that like?

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:11:52] With every new bit of information, it triggered the pain more, especially as the detective got involved and said, we realized that this wasn't an accident. And, and then, you know, and they slowly, because when they're investigating, I learned a lot about the judicial system and that whole thing more than I ever wanted to know.

It's not like CIS on TV or something, but

Damaged Parents: [00:12:13] It's not like that. You said, right?

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:12:15] Oh, no, it's like, it's a slower process, you know, as things aren't obvious and, and they have to take their time and they're careful with what they say, because they don't want you to share it with somebody that might've been involved, that gives them a heads up. So ultimately though what they told me and the horror of the whole thing is that my sons, the reason they knew it was a murder.

Is they found his body wrapped in a chain attached to a cinder block and that he had, they guess been throwing like off a bridge into the river that this particular river ended into a very deep Lake and had his body made it to that Lake. They said we most likely would never have found him. And you would never have known what happened to him. You know, and this hard as that information was to hear, I, my first thought was, Oh my God, thank God. His body was found. What if I'd never known? And I had to live with that pain of, he just disappeared off the face of the earth there had been really heavy rains. And so the river had Rose and his body got caught up on some debris and a fishermen found him.

And so yes, there that in, see, this is the whole thing about grief. The triggers don't go away in your lifetime.

Damaged Parents: [00:13:25] just said in your lifetime. So it's been

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:13:30] let's get triggered. It's been seven and a half years now, but it gets triggered again. So what we have to learn is how do we manage the triggers? And the other thing is, is that if we haven't ever dealt with grief, if we haven't been taught, when, when we're not taught how to deal with grief, where it's like something you try to get over, the thing is.

You don't get over it and you can't go under it or around it. You have to go through it. And if you haven't dealt with grief up until the time something really traumatic happens, it just adds to what you haven't dealt with already and makes it even more painful.

Damaged Parents: [00:14:03] So, was there something else you felt you hadn't dealt with that also came up for you too?

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:14:08] Well, I think for me, because I'd been on a spiritual path and teaching and pro and learn to process. I actually came through a very abusive marriage, the father of my sons. I had to escape that marriage. I went through a lot of trauma with that and the emotional impact on my sons. And I thought that was the worst thing I'd had to go through.

You know, I, my father had passed in 2007. I've lost, grandparents. So those things are all painful in life, but nothing prepared me. and this is what I had to wrestle with, that somebody intentionally chose to take my son's life. And ultimately I found out he'd been shot three times. So the corner assured me that, that he probably died instantly.

He probably didn't. You know, because your mind goes, was he in pain? Did he know what happened? It's like, and as a mother, I literally had nightmares for months. I could barely sleep because as soon as I was sleep, I would, I would go to imagining what his last moments in life were like.

Damaged Parents: [00:15:09] and you would wake up sweating, maybe I'm thinking.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:15:12] Yeah. And I, you know, and I, that still affects me sometimes. I mean, as a mother, that was my baby. How can somebody do that on purpose? How do you live with yourself? So my spiritual practice teaches forgiveness, so that was something I had to start working with. I didn't know, for 18 months who was responsible, it took that long for them to arrest somebody and

Damaged Parents: [00:15:36] Right. So, so how, how does, how did you, you didn't know who for this 18 months, you're waking up in a panic, you're upset all the time. You're crying in the pool and spa. How do you start forgiving? How do you transition from that pain and suffering? And I'm S I'm thinking probably a lot of anger to, how do you translate.

A lot of anger, you said? Yeah. How do you transition to forgiveness?

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:16:05] Well, one of the first things that I started to do again, it came from gratefully, I had a foundation of some practices is breathing exercises.

Damaged Parents: [00:16:15] Okay.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:16:16] When we are affected with something that's, you know, it's, it engages fear or anger or trauma in some way, pain in some way we tend to breathe shallow. And so, you know, if you notice how a baby breeds. And their little bellies go up and down because they're breathing the way we're designed to breathe fully engaged, not this shallow chest breathing. And so, I S I did a lot of breathing, practicing,  breathing deeply, breathing it in and, feeling it expand.

And then knowing as I exhale, I'm releasing any energy that's not helpful. And that helped me to calm down and help me process. Pain. It helped me in moments where it was really intense. And so that's a good beginning place. And then understanding what forgiveness is. Forgiveness is not, you know, saying that I I'm going to it's okay to let somebody off the hook,  you're still responsible and accountable for your actions.

Forgiveness is a spiritual practice of letting go of the energy that holds me back that keeps me in bondage. There is a spiritual saying that unforgiveness is like taking poison and expecting the other person to die. So we're holding onto it. It's going to affect our health. going to, our emotions are our mental capacity, our ability, because we get so caught up in that anger and rage and feeling like I want somebody to pay for this.

Damaged Parents: [00:17:38] And did you still, I mean, were you able to overcome that? I mean, I'm thinking it would be really hard. I have children, I'm thinking of how I would feel in that moment and it's not good. And I don't know how I would. I would transition to being able to forgive  and kind of going back to like, they know not what they do, but at the same time, I think I really would want them to pay.

So how did you reconcile that in yourself?

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:18:08] Well, again, I've been teaching it for a decade or more at that time. I don't remember how long it's been 25, 26 years now. And, and so I knew that for me, for my healing. It was a necessary practice and that I am not the one that's responsible for holding somebody accountable for their actions. The legal system will do that.

So I noticed like, well, what is mine to do? And what's not, what can I do? And I needed to process my anger in healthy ways so that I'm not holding on to it. So, I am a Walker. I would go for like, Massive Hill walks work the energy off. And you know, if I was out in the woods or something, I could just scream or take some rocks and throw it in, in the water, you know, it's like, there's a physical way of releasing that too.

But that the forgiveness process was, this is what I say to myself and what I teach people. I release anything and everything that no longer supports my health and wellness. And I embrace the only those things that support my highest, good mind, body spirit. And so I'm consciously, I let go of the anger. I let go of the regrets, the guilt all of that.

That's not helpful to me. And then I do what is useful and what I can do and trust the legal system to take care of the rest.

Damaged Parents: [00:19:29] so I'm thinking that is not a one-time process.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:19:33] No, it's a lifetime process too, because you know what, there's going to be more than one thing that comes up in your lifetime that you have to forgive for.

Damaged Parents: [00:19:42] Right. But even that process, I'm thinking from, from during that 18 months and then some, and still now probably two, when it comes up, you're still having to, to do that. No.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:19:56] Oh, yeah. Well, you know, when I wrote my book, Unraveling Grief and Mother Spiritual Journey of Healing and Discovery, and that was a very powerful healing process for me to get some real clarity of. What was I thinking when I was going through that? And I also have been to a parole hearing of one of the defendants, the the younger one that not the one that pulled the trigger.

Ultimately there was no trial. They plea bargained a deal after several years. The one that pulled the trigger, he was served. He was given 22 years. And he's eligible for parole after 15. The younger one is that this story isn't complete either. There's other people that were involved in this

Damaged Parents: [00:20:38] wow.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:20:39] they have not been able to get enough evidence in order to charge and convict because the legal system, if they can't convict somebody, they they're not going to pursue it.

And the other young man and this is what's tragic is like, you know, when somebody does something like that, it doesn't just affect. My life, my son's life. It affects their life and every, uh, their family, everybody that, is connected in this crazy experience is impacted. so this young man had information in exchange, so he was given 14 years without a minimum number of years for parole.

So he came up for parole after two years, I was surprised. But most systems,  the defendant doesn't serve the full time because they found that if they serve the full time, then they're not released on parole, so they're not supervised. So if they're released a little bit early, then they're released under supervision.

So they're less likely to re-offend. So that's where thinking. But anyway, this parole hearing came up and part of the process was I had the opportunity to write a statement of what I wanted to say to this person.

Damaged Parents: [00:21:47] wow. That must have been difficult.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:21:49] It was really it was challenging, but again, it was part of my healing because the experience is, and they're very supportive. There was a victim advocate assigned to me. And in the process, the defendant remained in prison. He was in a room and on a a camera. So he wasn't in the same room that I was in.

So I could see him on a big screen, but he couldn't see me. And then, because that it was be more intimidating otherwise. So I wrote the statement and in doing that, I let him know that my spiritual practice was to practice forgiveness. And so I forgave him or his actions, but I also held him accountable for his actions and that his choices put him where he was and he was where he needed to be. But that I hoped that he would use the system to heal his own or unforgiveness towards himself because he had showed some remorse. He kind of freaked out when he realized what he was facing. And apparently didn't know what was going to happen and freaked out when he was involved in it. He actually tried to commit suicide too.

So I know there was a lot of remorse in this young man's heart and. And so I said, for me, in order to honor my son, how you choose to live your life now, moving forward is how you can honor him so that you can be a better person when you are released from prison, some day than the one that you entered in as, and, and I really believe in that, you know, it's everybody's choice and how we're going to show up and how we're going to live.

And I think that. Coming back to what the forgiveness process is that we are responsible for our actions, but when we live in an unawareness of really who we are of our divinity, and that we're only caught up in the small minded thinking of our human survival mode, reality, we're not going to make healthy decisions.

But if we can begin to get in touch with there's something much greater about myself. And if I let that be my guide, I'm going to make healthier decisions. And so it was the the unawakened human side of himself that behaved that way. I believe there's a part of him that could transform who he is and be a better person.

So I'm holding for that.

Damaged Parents: [00:24:05] And you don't know yet. Right. And it was, he released on parole or no,

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:24:10] No I'm there. I just got a notice. They had have had two parole hearings. The last one was last spring and because of the pandemic it was canceled to where, I mean, I wasn't able to go to that one, but I sent a statement anyway, uh, he will be released in 20, 23. And in that, you know, I had a little bit of like, It just seems so soon, but it's the system and I don't have control over it.

So am I going to let myself get all caught up in, being upset about something I can't control?

Damaged Parents: [00:24:39] Yeah,

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:24:41] I just have to trust that he is going to be a better person and, I'm responsible for my life and how I choose to move forward. And so one of the things that. In the healing process that I realized that as we, we go deep into feeling our healing, then we have to shift to somewhere else.

We're not stuck in that. And for me, it's like it's shifting to the positive memories that I have in my heart. My son, he had beautiful blue eyes. He an engaging laugh, he lived large. Maybe. You know, he knew on some level that he was going to have to pack a lot into a shorter timeframe. He was very bold.

He jumped out of an airplane with a parachute, you know, it's like, he loved to do things that work on the edge, fearlessly and boldly. And so I looked as like, maybe that was his legacy to me, that. He's offered me how he lived his life and I get honor him by maybe being a little less fearful and you know, and like a little, little more bold, a little more out of the box, how I live my life could be a way that I honor him, but I started that by my just having those precious memories that are the gift that I can never be taken from me that I experienced with him.

Damaged Parents: [00:25:57] Yeah. And did you start that in, you started that in that eight to 18 month process, starting to remember, say, I need to not think about what happened, but to shift my thinking to these good times.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:26:11] Yeah. What I've discovered is that, a way to get out of the pain that overwhelms you that it's important to take intentional time to process that. But if you're out somewhere and it's like an and something gets triggered, it's like your mind has to go somewhere. How can I shift it? So I think about something that reminded me of, of him that made me laugh or smile and you know, he was quite a naughty little boy.

Damaged Parents: [00:26:35] yeah.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:26:35] I, so he was walking at nine months. He got into a lot of the stuff he just was curious. And so I would think about some of those things and, and I think that's what  the healing process of a Memorial service or a funeral is, is when we can share our, our stories about someone that we learned something more about the person that we're missing because every one of us in our relationship had different experiences.

So when we can share those stories, we learn more about them and we can get to the place of laughing and and as part of the healing process.

Damaged Parents: [00:27:09] Yeah,

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:27:10] So, I actually conducted the Memorial service for my son, with my family. We did it by, by water where he loved that and we all shared our stories and, and one of my mysteries of his life was resolved at that time. When he was three, he was constantly getting tonsillitis and, ear infections. And they had to put tubes in his ears and it's like, it was constantly. And so finally they said, well, his adenoids have to come out and his tonsils theirs. So they go in to do surgery and, you know, he's three years old. So I'm really anxious about that.

And the doctor comes out afterwards and he goes, well, we discovered the source of all the infections and he opens his hand and the ears, this little hot wheel tire that he had pulled off one of his little Hartwell wheel cars and stuffed it up as nose. And I got it embedded up in there and constantly was infecting.

Well, my nephew, who is two years older than him at the Memorial service said. That he says, well, I remember when Ryan, my other son that was also two years older than, than Justin it's. Like when we were,  teasing him, we dared him to stuff it up his nose and then it got stuck. And so we were afraid to tell you knew all along that that Hartwell was stuck up his nose he found out, and it was just, everybody just dropped and laughed and laughed.

It was like, I finally knew, and it was just a release

Damaged Parents: [00:28:40] Yeah.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:28:41] gene. And so those kinds of things can be part of our healing process.

Damaged Parents: [00:28:46] So it sounds like when, when you put together this Memorial service, it was really not focused on the loss so much as the memories that the good memories.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:28:56] It's about celebrating someone's life. You know, we celebrate a birth. You know, when somebody comes into the life, but we don't see the end of life as another transition that can be honored. So I see you know, a Memorial or however you want to choose. It's like it's honoring a life. And as we begin to share our stories, we begin to see there's some elements of how this person lived.

That could be a gift to us, that we could, they could serve us. Somehow. It might take a while to realize what it is. But there is a gift in that. And I think that's ultimately what the grieving process is all about  is discovering that gift. And then how can I use that moving forward? Because then I see how we're living is really living our own legacy.

What am I going to be leaving behind others as I move on?

Damaged Parents: [00:29:45] I think  when you say the legacy, what I'm thinking of is the positives, what am I leaving? That's going to make the world a better place.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:29:52] Yeah. It's like, we all make a difference by our existence. No matter what it is, we do. It doesn't mean we had to be famous and discover something or get a lot of public notoriety, but how we live made a difference to the people around us. And we don't always take the time to notice that I don't think I, and I think one of the precious little things that I realized, and it's always that when something you love is no longer available to you, you realize how important it was in your life.

So, but we can take time now to let the people in our lives that know that they're important. And maybe instead of feeling like I'm too busy to spend time with somebody. Rearrange your schedule because that's valuable time to share with somebody that matters to you.

Damaged Parents: [00:30:37] Right. So there, because someone's important to you making sure that you make the phone call and reach out or send the text message or just get to know them and ask interesting questions maybe.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:30:50] You know, there's so many things, we just have super critical conversation. And one of the things I love now with, uh, with my son, Ryan, he's he's turns 40 this year. I can't believe in June. How could I have a son? Who's gonna be 40, but,

Damaged Parents: [00:31:02] Do you not feel like you're still in your mind, like in your teens or twenties? Right.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:31:08] You know, and I think that, , we like this all about, you know, we decide how we're going to live in it's like age is just another year we Mark time. But, how we choose to live to make our life valuable and memorable, it's like, doesn't matter what your age is. I, so that's why health and wholeness is important to me.

And I noticed that when, when you go through something difficult, it's even more critical that we make healthy decisions for ourselves. And so I've tried to convey that to my son. And he has a daughter, my granddaughter's 12 and he's in Seattle, so we're not really close and it's been difficult the last year to see each other because of the pandemic.

Actually, haven't seen him in over a year now, but. We share things, you know, even if it's just texting or like when he's watching a football game and you know, it texts things. It's like, I want to be even things that he's interested in that I kind of go, Ooh, well, motorcycles. Okay. Well, it's not my thing, but I could talk to him about those things.

What is it you like about it? What is, what is it? That's fun. He has a whole group of friends. They do stuff like that. And now he's getting ready to buy his first house. So we sharing the process with me and, and he's open to  my thoughts and my guidance, but we have this relationship where I don't feel like I have to tell him what to do.

And he knows he doesn't have to do what I say.

Damaged Parents: [00:32:22] right. And it sounds like to me also that you leave room for him to be who he is and true to himself, whether or not you agree with that or not. I think that's actually really hard to do for a lot of parents.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:32:38] Oh, wow. It's a learning process. We don't have a manual, you know, like all relationships and so. I think one of the valuable things that comes out of grief is how we can start to reevaluate how we're living and how we interact with others. And maybe it's an opportunity heals some of our differences  and my son and I have had some really deep conversations.

We don't always agree with everything and yet You know, I've, come to understand it's important for him to feel free, to live his life. And I've been very clear with him. It's like, you know, every choice there could be a consequence. So be clear when you're deciding what you're going to do, are you ready to accept?

Whatever the consequence of that might be. One of the greatest gifts in my relationship with him was when my book first came out and he got a copy of it.  And he called me, like really early in the morning. We're like three hours time difference right now. And it would have been four in the morning for him.

Damaged Parents: [00:33:35] Oh, wow.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:33:36] And he said, mom, I went to bed last night, thinking I was going to read a couple chapters and just get started in your book. When he goes, I couldn't put it down. I read the whole thing. I just finished. He says I've been sobbing. I'm like gone through a whole box of Kleenex. I'm just like he goes, I can't, I had no idea.

What your experience had been. And because I went all the way back to the beginning of, I felt like I needed to share my relationship with Justin, who he was from the very beginning of when he entered the world. And I sort of have my before and after. That's how I view life. And so a lot of what I shared Ryan hadn't experienced and he's like, I have to go back through with my highlighter.

He goes, there's so much stuff. I had no idea. This is going to help me. You made a difference like, well, that's why I wrote this book. So it could help you.

Damaged Parents: [00:34:25] That's amazing that if it just touches one person and it happened to be your son and I have no doubt that it will touch more people. And so is, do you think that, I'm thinking the process of writing was also probably very hard.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:34:39] It was it was a process of healing. I wrote through a lot of tears.

 You know, I had to go deep into some things that maybe I compartmentalized and hadn't gone into for awhile. And I realized the deeper I could go into that. The more valuable. What I was sharing could be because I'm healing through the loss of a loved one is painful healing through the loss of a loved one from the act of violence, intentional act is excruciating.

Damaged Parents: [00:35:07] So you think it's like for you losing someone is one thing, but losing them this way is an, because it wasn't a natural cause was just absolutely devastating.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:35:21] I try to diminish anybody's pain from law because it's. Painful, no matter what, and as unique and individual, we can't compare each other's experiences. But I think when something is, violent and unexpected, and so you're left with this horror of imagination of,  what happened to a loved one is different than when it's a gradual process and you know, something's going to happen.

It's just different.

Damaged Parents: [00:35:47] Right. So the shock, maybe regardless of, how it happened when it's unexpected, right? Like

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:35:54] so there's a lot of rapport that's added to it that, that you don't have under a natural cause life

Damaged Parents: [00:36:01] maybe, maybe that's because the slower process, the morning already started a long time ago. And then with the immediate process, because. I'm thinking that, you know, whether he died from violence or choking, for instance, right. That it still would've been a shock and it's still, would've been a trauma, maybe not to the same extent, but it still would have, I just, I'm trying to understand the depth of it and I'm not certain I'm totally getting there.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:36:31] Well,  what I've come to understand is pain of loss is pain of loss. When someone you love is no longer living and you can't hold them, you can't hear their voice. You can't see their face. You can't, you know, in the loss of what his life potential may have been, you know, I imagine what, what else he might've done?

He didn't even make it to his 30th birthday. You know, we all go through that, no matter what the cause of the death is and it's painful. And so what we're mourning is  what no longer is what we can't experience. Which we're really attached to and having to shift to it's like release, not attachment and accepted different form of connection, because there's still a connection in your heart

Damaged Parents: [00:37:17] right.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:37:18] soul that shared their life experience with you.

It just changes and how we can come to accept that I think is how we can begin to move forward in life. And so, you know, I would never want to label anybody's pain as more painful than someone else, but it's just a different

Damaged Parents: [00:37:37] well, I think for you in, in your particular situation, You didn't get that chance to start mourning  ahead of time. It was violent. It was shocking. You know, so I was just more speaking to, to where you were at because I, I agree. Everyone's going to experience it differently and it's loss and it just plain old sucks for lack of a better word.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:38:04] And this is hard to come up with words to describe it.

Damaged Parents: [00:38:06] Yeah. I don't think I could explain that even to myself, what it felt like. So the fact that you were able to write a book about it,

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:38:16] Well, then I didn't do it in the first year. It took me a while to realize that there was something in me that was calling for me to do that. And I got to the place where it's like, I can't hold it back anymore. And so I look back and the last year as a pandemic and it was a very creative year for me, you know, I got done.

I actually also started up online repealing, , program of course that allows cause there's exercises and this my book it has exercises and Healing practices and some recorded guided meditation links that you can go to, in it, but the course takes it to another level. And so what I wanted to share was my story, but how did I grow in my own spiritual practice to support me in life and what can I offer others to heal grief?

And, and one of the things I'm actually, if you might just share from here,

Damaged Parents: [00:39:11] yeah, go for it.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:39:13] Thinking about what does great really w what does it do to us? And I had this aha moment and I wrote down my experience is that grief slowly creeps into every part of us, infiltrates our thoughts and feelings. It seeps into our emotions and it crawls into our hearts.

It finds its way into the cells of our body, and it takes over how it functions. It binds its way into every aspect of our lives, our relationships, how we respond to the world around us, our behaviors, our perception of life on every level. And in time we can't even recognize ourself as grief has taken up residence in who we are. And I think that's what we resist changes us.

Well, the thing is that I think, culturally society-wise we tend to think that,  okay, something bad happened. I had a loss I'm grieving, and then I'm going to get over this. And then I'm going to go on with my life and everything will, nothing will change, really accept that I'm missing this. Somebody that I love. And the thing is, is that grief changes us permanently at the core of who we are. , this loss has come in and it's taken up residence in who we are. So if we rejected, if we don't process it, if we don't acknowledge it and what's going on in ourselves, it will interfere with how we function in life.

It will interfere in relationships, and. And so we lose touch with who we are. And I think part of the healing process is coming to terms with who am I now becoming? Because I'm not the person that I was. And if I try to be that person, then it's going to affect me in a negative way. It's almost like we have to say that grief is my friend.

It has come into my life to offer me something of value. And in my healing process, as I go into feeling it and realizing what it is, I will learn something about myself and maybe something that I never would have taken the time to realize, or to come to terms with. If I had not had this experience, that becomes the gift.

Damaged Parents: [00:41:24] and it really does turn into a gift. Then this grief that's so painful. It almost sounds like a transitional period of time. Also. I mean, I was, as you were speaking, I was thinking of like teenage years, that transition from who I was to who I'm starting to be. And then again in the twenties, and it seems like it just happens every so many years.

We go through these transitions and it sounds like  if you're someone who experiences that grief. Any anywhere in the spectrum of time, right. That it also is a period of transition to becoming more of who you were meant to be and not who you think you were meant to be. Does that make sense?

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:42:13] Oh, absolutely. That's a good analogy because,  we accept that. We change in time as we age and we go through different periods of our growth and development process. But we don't think about things in terms of the things that happen to us or in our life experience also can affect us and change us, or maybe offer opportunities for us to explore who we are and discovering a new aspect of who we can be.

Maybe there's something that's already been percolating in there that I wanted to make a change. But I didn't have the courage or I wasn't sure how to do it, but this, this smack gives us a reality check on life. And if life is important and valuable, do I have the courage then to step out of the box and explore this new aspect of me or this new thing in life that I've kind of thought I might've wanted to do anyway, but realize.

Why would I want to wait? Life is, could be too short.

Damaged Parents: [00:43:18] so it became kind of a re a smack to you so that you could , I don't want to maybe wake up in some way and step  out of your comfort zone, because you were already out of your comfort zone, you were miserable, you were in pain and you were suffering. It sounds like.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:43:37] Well, exactly. So you know how our human mind talks us out of things. But if I've already experienced the worst case scenario right now, what do I have to lose? So to speak now, would I rather have my son back? Of course, but that's not going to happen. how can I use this to move forward in a way that I can transform my life in more empowering direction. we in more meaningful ways because I have a new level of awareness of how I'm moving forward. And you know, so I shifted from serving in ministry to a ministry to focusing on grief healing. And that's where I realized I really wanted to support people because I don't, I think sure. There's resources out there, but really focusing in on not just getting over the initial pain. But how can we use it to transform who we are to move forward in, in more empowering ways to, in meaningful ways and, and maybe have some support along the way to do that. You never know which way life is going to take. I, one of the things that I've taught is that, you know, life can be a crossroads and you know, in a crossroads, you, you have to choose a direction. So you choose a direction and maybe find that there's a dead end there. And so when you do you go back to the crossroad and you choose another direction. But when we went in we're in life, we might see it as a crisis. Oh my God. I picked the wrong thing. You know, it didn't work out. It's like, no, you learn something in that process.

Right. So use what we learned to go back and choose again, go another direction is all good.

Damaged Parents: [00:45:10] It sounds like grief can also be a blessing

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:45:15] In time, you know, I think it would be cruel to tell somebody, Oh, don't worry. This will be a blessing for you.

Damaged Parents: [00:45:20] Oh, I don't think I would ever say that straight out of the gate. I think that that recognizing it as a possibility though, might give me hope.  That that for some,  if I knew that for someone that grief turned into a blessing, I think I might have hoped that I could get there. And that's important to me to know that I could possibly get there.

Maybe I don't know how, and there might be a bunch of twists and turns and misery along the way, but I can get there and I can be okay.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:45:53] And that's important to realize it's like we have within us the capacity to get through this. It's not going to happen overnight. It's not going to be easy, but we can. And so, you know, in the beginning, it's like I said, be gentle with yourself, ask for support, let people know what they can do to help you.

They want to help you give them something, you know, and, and. And just be willing to be authentic about it, you know, and, and, and not hold back and say, you know what, I'm really having a hard time today. You know, I don't know how to move through this. And, and so can I help somebody help me by saying, you know, would she just be willing to sit with me?

We don't have to talk, or, I just knowing that you're available, that I could call makes a difference. It's a, it's a gradual process in time. And as you know, you come through it and you're willing to what I call field to heal. you can begin to see the valuable things that are being offered in it, and you can begin just to live in the, the treasured memories.

You can begin to see what you are missing. What. What things of value they offered you that perhaps could be useful somehow. So it's, it's a processing time and you know, and so it's not a race, it's not a competition. It's not like, well, okay, by the end of three months from now, we'll be fine. You know, that's not realistic to say.

Damaged Parents: [00:47:18] so don't put a timer. The other thing that I really, that just keeps really coming up for me during our conversation is give the gift of receiving. Because it really might be a gift to someone else. And to you, if you feel good, giving my thought is if I feel good giving and someone says, no, then they're taking that away.

And yet. Sometimes I need to be on the receiving end and sometimes they need to be on the receiving end because that's where that connection happens between us.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:47:53] Particularly we're taking away the opportunity for someone to give, if we say no, you know, and it can be hurtful to somebody. If they're rejected when they, and then they feel like, well, I don't know what else to do. I just want to help, you know, I've actually had that conversation with my mother because she's always somebody that, that she gets involved in community service programs and is like, likes to be a giver, but she is very private and she has rejected, opportunities to receive from others because it embarrassed her.

And I said, mom, don't you think they know that you have a need for help allow them to, to be able to give,  so that they can be a part of that giving receiving process of life. Don't take that opportunity away from them. And she,  in one moment in time, you know, she was able to say, well, I hadn't thought about it that way.

Damaged Parents: [00:48:44] Yeah, that's a hard one. Okay. So you have given us a tremendous amount of tools today. So I like to close with your top three. That you want other people to know about. So for you going through grief, dealing with that, what are the top three of your tools that you want someone else to the listeners to walk away with?

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:49:09] I would say self care is really important. You know, to take care of yourself, to be gentle with yourself and, you know, and that includes nutrition and, and what you feed yourself with all the things that are going to support you. Breathing allow yourself to breathe deeply so that you're not inhibiting that oxygen flow.

That also is a very healing process and and begin and be willing to feel deeply to begin to heal. So it's like shifting from feeling to healing so we can begin to see the gratitude and the experience that really moves us forward.

Damaged Parents: [00:49:45] Yeah, it really does. Well, thank you so much, Megan, for coming on the show today, I've really enjoyed our conversation.

Meghan Smith Brooks: [00:49:52] Thank you. It's

been fun for me too.

Damaged Parents: [00:49:54] Thank you for listening to this week's episode of Relatively Damaged by Damaged Parents. We've really enjoyed talking to Meghan about how she found a way to live. Again, we especially liked when she taught us that sometimes it helps to lean into the difficult feelings. To unite with other damaged people, connect with us on Instagram. Look for damaged parents. We'll be here next week still relatively damaged See ya then!